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Discussion in 'Data Protection' started by Shuriken1, Apr 8, 2005.

  1. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    Apologies if this topic has been covered before (am happy with referral links :)) but I would like some assistance.

    I'm new to CPanel hosting but I am planning a setup which requires complete confidence in the backup systems. My current plan is to have a primary server running on an ip (eg 1.1.1.1) and a backup running on a different ip (eg 1.1.1.10) which is backed up from the primary server frequently. Then, in the event of the primary crashing I will be able to change the backup to 1.1.1.1 and that can serve whilst I fix the main server.

    Now, the confusion begins with CPanel, I plan to have cpanel on both the primary and backup with their own licenses (let me know if I can share one somehow). So I will have something like this:

    Primary Backup
    1.1.1.1 1.1.1.10
    license 1 license 2

    The idea is, as I have mentioned, is that the backup server can replace the main by me switching the backup's ip to 1.1.1.1. Will cpanel still function in this situation? My thinking is that when the backup server goes to auth cpanel on the main ip, cpanel will expect 'license 1' but actually receive 'license 2' thus being invalid and being denied. Is this correct or am I thinking about it wrongly? If this is correct, how can I ensure Cpanel continues to function whilst the backup server is on the primary ip (1.1.1.1)?

    I hope I have made myself clear, thanks in advance.

    Shuriken.
     
  2. haze

    haze Well-Known Member

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    Well you have to consider that you'll probably have a difference in data unless you are constantly backup up.. all the time.. always.. kind of resource intense don't you think ? Have you considered some sort of hardware raid setup ? Will you be serving databases from each machine ?
     
  3. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    I am aware that it will be heavy on the servers but given the situation I think it is necessary. How could a raid setup help? I don't have much knowledge of raid so excuse my stupidity. Surely that would all be in one machine in which case it wouldn't be much a backup.

    They will be serving databases yes. Any idea on the cpanel license query?

    Shuriken.
     
  4. chirpy

    chirpy Well-Known Member

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    You will most likely need 2 cPanel licenses. You should contact billing@cpanel.net to confirm this.

    This type of setup has been talked about before on the forums and the conclusion was that it would be quite tricky to setup. you'd have to manually copy configuration data across when you create new accounts (or write scripts that will do this and the modify files to account for the different IP addresses). If you're using MySQL databases you'll be running a lot of mysqldump's to copy the data over since you cannot rely on the the data files themselves with mysql actively running. You also then have to cater for bringing the other server back online by writing procedures that will work in reverse.

    For proper resilience and reducndancy you're better off looking at a hardware solution that was posted on the forums a couple of months ago - but that costs a lot of money and requires significant hardware to achieve.

    Best of luck though, let us know if you succeed in doing it.
     
  5. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    Thanks for the info chirpy, I've also been considering a different setup which would average the load out over all the servers rather than having half working hard and there other half sitting there as backup. However, I had a quick think about the two and decided the above approach was better as each pair of servers would only be concerned with themselves. Either way, I would still have the backup issue you mentioned.

    What kind of hardware options are available to me? I don't honestly understand how raid can be of any use as if the server is dead, the server is dead. However, I am only a newbie to this, I'm sure I am overlooking something. :)

    The problem is that not only do I need to backup the data, I need to backup the service, ie. keep the sites up. So just backing up the data isn't really meeting the need. :(

    Thanks for the help so far,

    Shuriken.
     
    #5 Shuriken1, Apr 9, 2005
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2005
  6. gorilla

    gorilla Well-Known Member

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    you could run a system with 3 hd .
    where you use raid1 with 2 of the drives (raid1 means mirroring, in case one hd fails the other will take over ) and the 3rd HD would be for your backups.
    A dual cpu system would be appropiate to use and you dont need to pay for an additional cPanel licence , which in my opinion is a total waste ;)
     
  7. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    Thanks for your reply Gorilla, but that does not help if the server dies completely. I know its not very likely, but I need to cover it as an eventuality. I will remember it as a possiblity all the same though :).

    Regarding the second license, I agree, but I'm not sure of an alternative yet. :confused:

    I can't help thinking there is a better setup all together..

    Shuriken.
     
    #7 Shuriken1, Apr 9, 2005
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2005
  8. gorilla

    gorilla Well-Known Member

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    a server dying completely it is a very unlikely scenario, you would need a mayor powersurge to fry the hardware, although your datacenter should have surge protection anyway !
    And hire yourself a competent security sys admin and you'll never have any visible problems with the software. :D
    Its a very good idea of thinking ahead and beeing cautius but no need to overcompensate for ones unnatural paranoia ! ;)
     
  9. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    I was following the better-safe-than-sorry approach but I will look into this further, maybe a backup as discussed is unnecessary. As I said, I am new to dealing with servers so I do apologise for any stupid remarks :eek:

    Thanks for you help Gorilla, I will give this some more thought.

    Shuriken.
     
  10. gorilla

    gorilla Well-Known Member

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    your approach is in the right direction, good luck with it all :)
     
  11. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    :) Thanks. It's just that the nature of this project dictates that it HAS to work, I can't afford to have server problems. I want to be confident that the system I implement will work and I can be happy with it.

    Thanks again for your help.

    Shuriken.
     
  12. gorilla

    gorilla Well-Known Member

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    then i would suggest to you to get a good sysadmin, there are some great ones on the forum here, and bounce some setup ideas of them initially and employ one for server admin duties, so you only need to worry about looking after your new clients
     
  13. Shuriken1

    Shuriken1 Member

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    Yeah, I will consider it. The server is going to be managed and secured by my hosting company before I get it, so I won't need to do that kinda stuff (thank god :p). I'm sure I can wrangle a few friends in to help me. :)

    Shuriken.
     
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