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Spam Haus options?

Discussion in 'E-mail Discussions' started by heyjohnboy, Mar 3, 2008.

  1. heyjohnboy

    heyjohnboy Well-Known Member

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    We received a call from Spam Haus last week informing us that they will soon begin charging to use their service. We don't mind paying something, but the price they are asking is (at least to us) fairly steep and not very practical at the moment. Since support is now built into cpanel, are there any plans to add a different service? What's everyone else planning to do?
     
  2. nyjimbo

    nyjimbo Well-Known Member

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    Interesting that they called you, I dont see anything on their website about this policy change nor do I see anyone talking about it on the popular web hosting chat boards. Are you getting a datafeed from them or just using the regular rbl entries in your exim config files ?

    :confused:
     
  3. opt2bout

    opt2bout Well-Known Member

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    From http://www.spamhaus.org/zen/index.lasso:

    To that end, it would appear that every WHM user in the world would fall under the category of "Commercial Use" and therefore should be paying for this service?? Wow, $16,800 for unlimited per year.
     
  4. heyjohnboy

    heyjohnboy Well-Known Member

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    We've just been using the regular rbl entries in exim. They told us they would be changing over to provide a feed to us (which theoretically would drastically lower their bandwidth and server load to provide their service). They also told us we could "try" the service for 30 days for free, and then we would have to pay.

    I'm not sure how they picked us to call, but I'd venture to say more companies will be receiving calls.

    We wouldn't be opposed to paying a mimimal fee, but they want to charge per mailbox (as opposed to a flat fee, which would make more sense to us since they'll just be providing a feed). If you have up to 10,000 mailboxes they are asking for $2,250 annually. Even if you only have 1,000 mailboxes they want $1,500. We'd be happy to pay them perhaps even $50 per month for the feed service, but this is simply too much in our estimation.

    Here's a link to their price calculator: http://www.spamteq.com/ma/datafeed/pricecalculator.lasso

    Any other options, or do we have to use Spamcop by itself now? They claim to be 20-25% more effective than Spamcop.
     
    #4 heyjohnboy, Mar 6, 2008
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2008
  5. troxalias

    troxalias Well-Known Member

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    Time for an Open DNSBL service based on open source software and community support :) I would be delighted to support such a project in the extent i am able to :)
     
  6. nyjimbo

    nyjimbo Well-Known Member

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    Hmmmm... I might be wrong, but I think I smell a reseller out there. :confused:

    Is it possible that "Messaging Architects" contacted you on "behalf" of SpamHaus, "sort of" ?
    I know when we were selling dialup we were constantly contacted by some company on behalf of verizon trying to sell us new features. It seems that "Messaging Architects" calls themselves the "Exclusive North America Sales & Support for Spamhaus"

    Spamhaus has its own pricing calculator and its own service application form. What you gave a link to SEEMS TO BE a reseller or some kind of third-party. Is it possible you are getting some kind of sales pitch from another company and you dont REALLY have to go to the datafeed ?
     
  7. everity

    everity Registered

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    I've had a lot of false-positives from SpamHaus. I wouldn't use it even if they paid me. My advice would be just to stop using them.
     
  8. tooky

    tooky Member

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    cpanel users beware of spamhaus

    Hi,

    Do not give Spamhouse any money!!. Spamhaus is in trouble, they have an $11,000,000 judgment against them from the state of Illinois. Here is a link to that story: http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20061008/163213.shtml

    I am a long time cpanel user, but I am fighting really hard to keep my hosting company going right now. Spamhouse has blacklisted my server ip and given me no course for restoration. I have been unable to send emails from my ip for 35-40 hours now.

    They have recently blocked my ip in an sbl listing. My ip was blocked because it was in the same range as someone else's at my data center. Apparently a user within that range of ips sent some mass email out. According to Spamhaus, the data center is the only one who can deal with it. Even though my ip was erroneously included in this listing, Spamhaus has given me no appeal. They are basically treating me like a criminal. They even sent one of my requests to be de-listed to the abuse dept. at my isp!! Furthermore this same problem occurred once in the past causing a substantial loss of income for me.

    Spamhaus is not being careful about who they blacklist. They are treating legitimate small business owners like criminals. Guilty until proven innocent so to say. For this reason and the fact that they are working outside the law here in the U.S. I would not spend the money!! BTW they even claim to be a non-profit...If they are a non-profit, what do they need $16,000 a month for?

    All the best,

    Jon T.
     
  9. nyjimbo

    nyjimbo Well-Known Member

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    That article is from Mon, Oct 9th 2006, you need to read more about the suit from an updated source http://www.spamhaus.org , go to the left side and click on " Spamhaus Statements on Issues and Events" and then near the bottom "2006-09-14 Court Answer: e360Insight vs. The Spamhaus Project " . The $11 million judgement was not because Spamhaus was wrong, it was because they did not answer the lawsuit and the other side got a default judgement.

    Spamhaus is going to be around for a long time and they are the best choice for RBL's at this time.
     
    #9 nyjimbo, Apr 11, 2008
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2008
  10. tooky

    tooky Member

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    spamhaus is still unfairly blocking my main cpanel ip

    Hi,

    I do know about the lawsuit, and I agree that e360 is not a shining star. I also agree that Spamhaus could have done a better job defending themselves. I'd just stipulate that they are liable for that judgement especially if they want to do business here in the U.S. They should be acting a little more responsibly when it comes to judges and rulings. Insulting the American judicial system is not the best idea.

    My problem has nothing to do with that judgment. It has everything to do with Cpanel and its users.

    I have an ip that has been blacklisted unfairly. This practice of banning ips that are similar to the ip of a spammer is unacceptable.

    Cpanel users must beware of this, if it gets your main ip, you are done! Your resellers below you are going to be affected as well. Any recipient of email from your ip who has the Spamhaus list is going to bounce your email as junkmail. And this will all happen because Spamhaus has discovered someone with an ip similar to yours sending spam.

    A Spamhaus SBL record can do a lot of damage to a cpanel user who uses one ip for multiple accounts.

    As a matter of fact, if they do not de-list my ip soon, there is a strong possibility I will no longer need cpanel or my web hosting server! I pay a monthly fee of $35 for cpanel and quite a bit more for the server..

    I have confidence the cpanel staff will make a good decision. The choice is to pay real money for a list that can harm non-spamming cpanel users. Alternately they can forget paying for the list and help eliminate the risk of cpanel users being wrongfully blacklisted..

    Trust me you don't want this to happen to your cpanel account. It has happened twice now to me and is still unresolved at this time!

    Regards,

    Jon T.
     
  11. nyjimbo

    nyjimbo Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, but this all sounds pretty weird to me. If you have a blocked IP this is not a cpanel issue. Everyone is using Spamhaus, regardless of o/s, control panel, MTA, etc. I've seen worse problems with other RBL's like Spamcop, SORBS and even ORDB before that one shut down.

    Why not post the IP range you are in. In the past Spamhaus has only blocked ranges of real trouble maker ISPs. If you are on a blocked host you should be more public as to what host it is or what the range is so that other people dont get screwed using that web host.

    No ISP or Hosting Provider will last very long if their IP range is blocked, smtp is critical to anyone with a server or to resellers or hosting providers. So my feeling is that there is more to this story that you should be posting if you want people to take it seriously. You should be fighting with your host or find a new one.

    btw- Disregarding a lawsuit and getting a default judgement is almost an american past time. MILLIONS of americans do it yearly and avoid paying as best they can. I'm not condoning it, but almost everyone knows someone who has been sued for something and most people do their best to avoid paying on a judgement.
     
    #11 nyjimbo, Apr 11, 2008
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2008
  12. tooky

    tooky Member

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    thanks for your interest, I have all the info for you

    HI,

    Yes first of all thanks for taking interest in my problem here!

    The sbl listing is public: http://www.spamhaus.org/SBL/sbl.lasso?query=SBL64224

    My server is listed in the rdns record, In that record I am: rocketmediahosting.net You can clearly see that my server is the odd man out.

    Though my home page is a little outdated, I have an extensive billing and domain registration system in place. I work with two data centers to provide quality web hosting, ftp, and email for media professionals and all. The company is registered and based in the city of Los Angeles, CA. We have been hosting websites for about 5 years. The parent or sister company, Rocket Films, has been around for 12 years or so.

    I am happy with my current data center which is Calpop. Calpop is a huge data center which is bound to have problems with spammers to some degree. Furthermore Spamhaus has acted unprofessionally in helping me to resolve this issue. I have no reason to abandon the data center other than this erroneous listing.

    It did happen once before in the past which indicates to me that Spamhaus is a little wreckless when they block a range of ips. . I can try to find the listing for that one too, but it has been over a year.

    The bottom line is that spamhaus has caused me a huge headache and left me with no course of action except to contact calpop. Calpop has apparently spoken to them, however the listing is still there at this time.

    Can I change my ip? I really don't want to do that, but will it come to that?...That is a bit complicated, I may need to open a support ticket with cpanel.

    Any thoughts??

    J

    oh yeah and my 2 cents on the judgement.. :] I know my @ss would be on the grill if I was sued for $11,000,000. I really don't think it is any different for our poor friends at Spamhaus. I'm quite sure having that over their head is not making them cry tears of joy. I do also agree with your statement in that one can live outside the laws of this country. For a businees it can't be too much harder.
     
  13. tooky

    tooky Member

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    one question for heyjohnboy

    Heyjohnboy,

    Do you happen to have the phone number for Spamhaus? I wouldn't mind giving these guys a call directly to see if I can get my ip-delisted. Other cpanel users may need to get in touch with them some time as well.

    Also, I am also working on a cpanel trouble ticket regarding this issue. I feel cpanel support needs to know about how difficult getting de-listed can be when the listing involves a range of ips.

    All the best,

    Jon T.
     
  14. ckh

    ckh Well-Known Member

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    I think the first step would be to request the delisting:

    http://www.spamhaus.org/lookup.lasso

    I checked the link that you gave me and it didn't show anything. You may have already been delisted.
     
  15. tooky

    tooky Member

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    spamhaus sbl listing

    That link must have broken some how. Try this:

    http://www.spamhaus.org/SBL/index.lasso

    then enter the search sbl# at the bottom: SBL64224

    I have contacted suppoort at my data center as well as spamhaus. I am also attempting to get the data center to put in a ticket with cpanel. The issue remains unresolved.

    cheers,

    Jon T.
     
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