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Suggestion for backup

Discussion in 'Data Protection' started by comforthost, Sep 15, 2007.

  1. comforthost

    comforthost Member

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    Hi

    Backup script is really cpu consuming. The rsync it does to move daily to weekly scripts and weekly to monthly is really a loss of cpu without really an advantage. I guess that not much can be done for the daily: files have to be gathered and copied. but for weekly and monthly backups a much better procedure, instead of a rsync, would be:

    monthly:
    rm -rf /backup/cpbackups/monthly
    mv /backup/cpbackups/weekly /backup/cpbackups/monthly

    weekly:
    rm -rf /backup/cpbackups/weekly
    mv /backup/cpbackups/daily /backup/cpbackups/weekly

    Obviously the overhead for the server when deleting and renaming one folder is almost insignificant. while now it takes hours. And obviously it is important the order: daily backup should be done after creating the weekly.

    Quel
     
  2. boatdesign

    boatdesign Well-Known Member

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    I would think your proposed change would result in a lot more disk IO load which could be a big disadvantage to those who have the typical off-the-shelf server which is stronger on CPU than disk IO.
     
  3. Danny_T

    Danny_T Well-Known Member

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    I was think also about another sollution. It takes indeed hours to complete the task and getting high load server messages.

    It would be nice to have a backup tool that runs remotely. So gzipping etc is done on a dedicated server for example...

    My backups are running for almost the whole night. The box is realy heavy loaded at night with all the crons.
    As cpbackup is the heaviest, it would be nice for a better something.
     
  4. nyjimbo

    nyjimbo Well-Known Member

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    Does anyone just totally bypass the cpanel backups and do their own?. We use the cpbackups to do the system stuff daily, but not customer account backups and so every other day we do hard disk "mount point" backups to a secondary hard drive and several times a month do rsync "pulls" of those .tar and .pax files to a server created just for backups and oddball Cpanel testing. It's all automated and creates alot of checkpoints for restoration.

    Maybe its just me but the cpanel method of backing up whole accounts is alot more disk i/o and much more system impact than just doing a tar/pax backup. Granted its not a clean one-key reinstall via WHM when an account dies, but its rare we ever have to do it that way, its more likely a customer wants a file or two and we dont need to do a whole account restore.
     
    #4 nyjimbo, Sep 16, 2007
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2007
  5. Boriskag

    Boriskag Well-Known Member

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    Are hosting companies even responsible for user files if they get lost?


    I understand something happens server side, where backups should be kept, but if a client requests a file that they had deleted or changed, are they not responsible for it?
     
  6. linux.newbie

    linux.newbie Well-Known Member

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    Check the Terms of Service and User Policy of the host. I am sure their backup policy will be mentioned there.
     
  7. hostmedic

    hostmedic Well-Known Member

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    r1soft

    I have been looking into r1soft.com

    r1soft appears to have a great solution - and will even work with the cPanel control panel for clients....

    This is what I saw: http://www.r1soft.com/pdf/R1Soft_cPanel_Presentation.pdf

    anyhow wondering who is using... and how well it works.
     
  8. boatdesign

    boatdesign Well-Known Member

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    As said, many hosts put in their TOS that they are not responsible for providing backups if a customer corrupts or deletes a file. Even many top-quality hosts have this in their TOS... that backups are only in case of system failure and clients are responsible for their own backups. (one for example images the whole server drive so it would be difficult for them to retrieve a single file for example.)

    On the other hand, as a host if you do have a backup and save a client's business, I bet you have a client for life.
     
  9. mata hari

    mata hari Registered

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    well, probably not by formal view of policy. Moste hosting companies exclude any responsibility.

    however, if the hosting company advertises with (i.e.) "monthly, weekly, daily backups" then there it is a question of trustworthy, to be responsible nevertheless, and some courts also may decide that this is enough to cause a formal and financial responsibility, too.
    You can write a lot in your TOS, but this says not automatically it is valid. National law may be vary, and different courts also may decide different. But to discuss such legal points of TOS here is the wrong place.

    In any case, if a hosting company steps back to the formal non liability for backups, then very soon customers will go, as one of the main requirements is not given or not trustworthy.

    A hosting company has to do the best to secure that in case of a restore all data will be available.

    Mata
    http://1steuro.net/
     
  10. MaraBlue

    MaraBlue Well-Known Member

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    We do both. After having a HD crash last spring (3 days before migrating to a new server, no less), I'm paranoid :)

    Have you ever had to use the full restore? And did it work? I've heard so many horror stories about backups not being valid (not necessarily cPanel, but in general), uisng only one method of backing up makes me nervous.

    I had an issue yesterday with moving our billing system, including the db. Didn't work the first time (copying over the db in phpMyAdmin....I know, not the best way to do it but I'd been working for an insane number of hours straight already), but when I restored the very same db (but a different day's backup, from a mysqldump) via MySQL shell...worked fine.

    I'm assuming the data got corrupt by the way I did it the first time (using phpMyAdmin). I'm just wondering if you've had issues with restoring accounts, especially any that had sizable databases.
     
  11. MaraBlue

    MaraBlue Well-Known Member

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    Each company has a different policy, but even when customers are told backups are their responsibility...they still get upset and/or blame the host.
     
  12. Infopro

    Infopro cPanel Sr. Product Evangelist
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    Same here. Several years ago for us but it was painful. We backup to second drive each nite and twice a month do backups to the home server now. (daily and weekly backups configured in WHM)

    I have used account restore in the past several times and it worked perfectly. Granted they were all accounts under 1GB but it worked. Not sure I want to try it on a very large account.

    I never use phpMyAdmin for anything except optimizing. Shell is best.
    IMHO, probably.

     
  13. MaraBlue

    MaraBlue Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply!
     
  14. Bailey

    Bailey Well-Known Member

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    We use r1soft and love-love-love it. :D

    To put it bluntly, it kicks cPanel's backup system's butt. To the curb. ;)

    :D Bailey
     
  15. MaraBlue

    MaraBlue Well-Known Member

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    Hey, thanks for the reply. I've never heard of r1soft before, but with a recommendation like this , I'll be checking it out.

    :cool:
     
  16. sarhosting

    sarhosting Well-Known Member

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    Backup is a real pain in the rear end and takes time and a fair bit of money if you are serious about the whole backup process. We have a few fail safe backup features in place:

    * Each one of our servers has the good ole Riad 1 - taking a copy everynight and then storing locally for 24 hours

    * We then have 3 x backup servers taking copies of the copy and all settings and email etc

    * Thirdly we have an offsite backup facility in place, you just never know.

    All this helps us to provide a great backup service and the customer can rely on it too.
     
  17. cPanelDavidG

    cPanelDavidG Technical Product Specialist

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    R1Soft presented at this past cPanel Training Seminar. They definitely had an interesting presentation/product.
     
  18. MaraBlue

    MaraBlue Well-Known Member

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    I'd have liked to have seen that presentation...I got totally lost on their website.
     
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